Some further questions about the Koptalk Athens scam.

by Koptalk Outsider

Duncan Oldham is very clear that payment for the seats on the flights to Athens will not be handled by Koptalk.

That being the case – he does not need the credit or debit card details of travellers, and he doesn’t ask for them – does he?

Well I’m not so sure about that. We are talking about a lifelong con artist who has been investigated by the police and Trading Standards for his internet scams and who has been caught out in barefaced lying. In the last ten years he has learned how to reel people into crooked schemes by using ambiguous weasel words. For reference to his criminal frauds on the net go HERE.

With his history his announcements deserve extra caution. So lets look at this one again.

“The operator has asked us to take all bookings and fax them through to them to save the workload at their end”.

There’s a weasel word right there. “Has to take all bookings”. Oldham, by his own admission, is not responsible for any bookings. He is simply referrring the names of those applying for a seat. The operator is required by law to book each and every one no matter if it comes as a referral from Koptalk or elsewhere.

“They will then take payment and confirm everything with you. KopTalk is not processing any payments in relation to your bookings.”

Well that’s clear enough. Or is it? The operator will contact you and ask for credit or debit card details and take it from there?

Or does Oldham’s vagueness on this point leave room for a role for him in contacting you and asking for that information? Let’s read on until this point becomes clearer.

“We have to complete a form they have provided us for every person booking to obtain your statement that you are a Red etc. All subsequent questions and dealings will then be between you and the operator.”

Clear enough again. But I have to ask why the operator needs Koptalk to take those details which the operator is going to have to obtain independently from the traveller at the time of payment. If this is just a scheme to register Oldhams’ interest and secure his commission why doesn’t he say so?

“We’ve simply secured a limited amount of seats for you.”

How many is that – 1, 10, 100? What do you mean by “secured”? Have you guaranteed the payment of those seats if you don’t get enough people signing up through you? How long will you keep people on hold waiting to hear back from the operator for confirmation of their booking when they could be looking elsewhere?

“Payment will be made by debit or credit card. There is a 2% charge when paying by credit card. It may be possible to pay by cheque but we think this will delay things and you may miss out.”

I’m very suspicious of the reference to cheques. Apparently it may be an option from the operator, but Oldham tries to scare you into not using it. Obviously he wants you to use a debit or credit card. Why?

(Postcript:  Since I posted this Insider Insider has posted in the Comments below how he found an operator selling flights at the same price quoted by Oldham but the operator prefers cheques).

Then he asks you to email him the following information:

“* Lead name on booking (same name must be on passport) e.g. Rafael Benitez

* Address

* Post Code

* Contact telephone number

* Number of flight tickets required including your own

* Who you support (legal requirement by Greek authorities)

* Which airport you want to depart i.e. Gatwick or Liverpool

Do NOT include your payment details at this stage.”

A lot of personal stuff there for Oldham’s files, all of which you will need to submit directly to the operator later. So why does Oldham have to have them ? If it is so he can claim his commission why doesn’t he say so?

And his not needing credit card details is clear again – or is it? Is “at this stage” another of his weasel words?

“Once we have the information above we will complete your booking form and then contact you regards payment.”

Oh oh! Now he’s talking about contacting you regarding payment. But he gave the impression earlier that it would be the operator doing that.

“KopTalk is not processing the payment, we are faxing this through to the operator who will process and confirm your booking.”

More weasel words. Does this mean that he will fax through to the operator the simple fact that you prefer to pay by card or cheque or that he will be faxing all your credit and debit card details. It looks like the latter. But to confuse you further on this point he reiterates that he is not “processing ” payment.

So he is taking your credit and debit card details and faxing them to be processed by the operator?

Now, this is worrying. Why would he need the credit and debit card details? Couldn’t the travel company do this part? Is it even legal for Oldham or the Koptalk website to collect such details anyway?

Already there are questions about who is actually doing the booking, who is being paid – Koptalk or the operator – and who is responsible for performance of the contract.

“The contract is between you and them…”

Who is “them” – why not tell us?

“..so if anything goes t*ts up, we will not accept any liability etc. The same applies to us as we will be booking seats ourselves on the same flights… maybe even one for Katie!”

Which seems a bit superfluous since he said he bought his tickets for ₤110 weeks ago.

“The operator will instruct KopTalk when all availability has gone. At this stage we will then remove this announcement. Your booking is not guaranteed until the operator contacts you direct.”

So Koptalk is not doing the booking, after all?

“After submitting payment details…”

To whom – to Oldham or the operator and if the latter who is the operator?

“..we’ll see you have all the necessary details needed to check your booking or make changes with the operator..”

But you said earlier that all contact and all such confirmation will be direct between the operator and the traveller.

“They have also told us that they will change names on tickets for free should someone have to drop out of your party.”

Is this operator licensed – is it in good standing with the regulatory authorities and the travel industry? Is it legal to change the name on tickets? Sounds to me like this company is as desperate as Oldham to get payment and asks question afterwards.

“At this time we are trying to find out how quickly they will confirm your booking as you can’t be left around waiting and not knowing. We will update this announcement as soon as we hear back.”

You mean you made this announcement without knowing that crucial detail? You claimed you had “secured” a number of seats,. Why can’t confirmation be almost instant?

If you want credit and debit card details and orders so you can then shop around for a few days or week to find seats which pay you a commission why don’t you say so?

“All questions should be submitted via a support ticket at http://www.koptalk.info – if we can’t answer, we’ll put you in touch with the operator.”

Why not put us in touch with the operator now? That way we can avoid the delays and weasel words that is typical of support tickets on Koptalk. And what is the point of talking to you anyway since you have said in advance you will not accept any responsibilities for the information?

“If you want to go, book now. Don’t faff around as the operator has told us they have limited tickets left.”

Well, you have secured a number of seats already, haven’t you, that’s what you just said. So why not put that number up and update when people book. Then we’d know how fast we need to act.

“Once they’re gone there won’t be any planes left to fly people over. Most airlines are chartering in planes from overseas to cope with demand. We will organise meet ups on flights, in Athens and wherever. Get involved!”

So this will be the last operator to have tickets left? When this operator is sold out, everyone else will be as well?

If all Oldham is saying is please put money in my pocker rather than in the pocket of some genuine, licensed tour operator – why doesn’t he say so?

“See you there!”

No, you won’t!

When Oldham was investigated for selling Sky cards that he did not deliver he simply changed his name and skipped from Scarsborough to Wallsend and changed his con from Sky to LFC.

But his appetite for money has grown since then. He has declared he is preparing a bolt-hole abroad. Anyone who hands over personal details and credit and debit card information to him is taking a huge risk.

Don’t rely on the credit card company to reimburse you if he defrauds you now or in a few months when you are not looking. They may consider that you did not keep your side of the bargain not to expose you card to unusual risk. Giving it to a known con artist for a deal that is full of weasel words is unusual risk.

Bull-direct

I’ve been quiet again of late, but I’ve been popping in an out of Koptalk, and I do try to read all my emails, even if I don’t actually reply to them. Apologies to anyone who writes and gets no reply.

Dunk’s been busy again, on his little fantasy island.

And how I’ve laughed. You too?

Where’s the book? Where’s the van? Where’s the house near Melwood he’s buying  off Chris Waddle? Where’s the LFC-themed hotel he’s building in Liverpool? They’re all old fantasies. Now he’s talking of being the next airline mogul with his offer to charter a plane to Athens. Lazyjet? And then he finds, oh so conveniently, that there isn’t enough room at the airport to park his plane.

It must be quite hard for someone so dim to grasp the concept that every time he reveals one of his wild fantasies he finally tips at least one of his doubting members over the edge towards the truth. And each one of those usually takes a handful of others with them.

Not that there are many members left who have friends on Koptalk. What I mean is, their friends, if any, will be away from Koptalk. You can’t send a PM on Koptalk. You can’t find out someone’s MSN address, you can’t find out their email address. You have to go through “the daddy”, who even vets his sidekick Steve’s email before he lets him send any replies.

What is worrying is his Athens flights idea. Anyone who lives outside the Koptalk bubble knows damn well that you wouldn’t trust Dunk with an old bent penny. But some of his members may not be so aware. They’re still either caught up in the cult, or just don’t believe that such a dopy fat fantasist would actually want to rip them off.

No name is mentioned of the operator, if indeed there is one. I find it doubtful that there would be, and if there was they would allow Dunk to advertise in the the way he has. If there is an operator, Dunk is seriously worried we might find out who it is and warn them. We have warned ABTA, ATOL and Consumer Direct. We’ll find out soon enough if they are useful organisations who’ll protect consumers. The other reason Dunk would hide the operator’s name is because he knows he could earn a decent commission if he can con enough people to book through him.

And that’s the con. Dunk always tells us he gets no wage from Koptalk. He does if for the love of LFC – he claims. All the moeny that comes in covers the costs of hosting he claims comes in at £600 per month (we checked – he pays £97 per month in fact).

So why would he need to make a profit out of these flights? Surely he could offer them at a lower price, in return for no commission at all! He needs to make his mind up – is Koptalk there to make a profit, or is it a hobby for him and his unwaged family?

The real worry in all of this is that Dunk will be getting access to people’s personal information, and their credit card details. He claims the operator wants him to collate all the booking forms, including credit card details. This is the person who charges three times for one thing. The person who sells dodgy goods, fake Sky viewing cards, fake signed merchandise. The person who tells his readers to install spyware, using his affiliate link so he can make money from them.

And now he wants credit card details!

If you’ve already supplied him with any credit card details I urge you to speak to your bank immediately. Explain that you’ve passed your credit card details onto someone who’s been under scrutiny for some time over his business practices. Someone who collected thousands of pounds “for charity” but never, ever, showed a shred of evidence that he’d handed it over.

Someone who expects his poor ripped-off members to believe bullshit like this. Yes, the original reason for this blog was to show “outsiders” what the “insiders” were paying for. And this is what your £30 brings you these days…

#159143 – Yesterday at 12:53 PM Eto’o latest
KOPTALK.COM KOPTALK.COM Administrator
Team Member

Registered: 28/07/03
Posts: 30965

Italian giants AC Milan are stepping up their attempt to sign Barcelona striker Samuel Eto’o.

Milan officials are trying to arrange a meeting with the player’s representatives to discuss a possible summer move.

Chelsea, Manchester United and Arsenal has also been linked with the player but Liverpool are believed to have already touched base with the player’s agent.

Barcelona want to sign Xabi Alonso in the summer and would be prepared to negotiate a deal with the Reds if it meant that they could take the Spaniard back to Spain.

KopTalk understands that Reds boss Rafa Benitez has a short-list of six strikers and that Eto’o along with David Villa sit at the top of that list. Klaas Jan Huntelaar and Carlos Tevez are other names that the boss has an interest in. David Trézéguet is another candidate but we believe he’s more of a fall-back option.

News from within Anfield is thin at the moment but we hope to provide a more detailed update once the Charlton game is out of the way.
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